I bought the Raichle 724 Boots

Post by **goofyfoot53** » Tuesday 17 November 2009, 9:38

I drove to Pasadena yesterday to look at and try on the Burton Wind Boots. They were in very nice condition and the buckles are nice. Microadjustable just like ski boots and they seem fairly robust. When I tried them on my toe hit the end, as expected, but a little harder than in my ski boots. The seller had a board for sale too so I clamped into the bindings, also Burton, to see what the boots felt like when I leaned into turns. My feet didn’t move around much so there wasn’t any increased pressure on my toe when I leaned back into a backside turn. Conversely, pushing into a front side turn didn’t relieve much pressure either. The forward flex would be too soft for me for skiing but I don’t know about snowboarding. The cuffs were a bit loose and there is no power strap so one would have to be added and maybe a tongue pad to take up some of the slack and give a more upright stance. The forward lean adjustment seemed a little cheap with a plastic lever so I don’t know how long it would last, but everyone replaces these anyway, right? The bottom line is that these would hurt a bit but I could tolerate them with the mods mentioned.

BTW, the board was not a true carving board but instead, a wider standard freeride board that for some inexplicable reason the owner had painted blue. I have wondered if you could use a wider standard board with carving boots and bindings and apparently you can. He had the rear binding set 90 degrees to the board which I guess you can get away with a wider board.

Anyway, when I woke up this morning the boots had jumped from$28 to $150+, which is more than I wanted to spend. I checked the Raichle 724 Boots I have been watching and no one had bid on them. I had been trying to find out the size for some time but the seller kept saying there were no size markings anywhere on the boots. I finally suggested that he pull the liners and measure the inner footbed. When he did this, he saw that the inside was marked 28-30.5. At first that scared me but then I remembered that the Burton Winds were marked 27.5-29. Members here helped me to realize that the 27.5 was the mondo size and the 29 was the bottom length, 29cm or 290mm. Therefore, I concluded that the Raichles were 28.0 mondo and 305mm in length. I believe in these types of boots, a 28 will be better as long as they are not too loose. If they are, I could put in an extra footbed and/or the extra thick green superfeet. I noticed that the Raichles have a top strap but I don’t know how well it works. I saw that the auction ended about a half hour before I would get home from work so I put in a bid. I got home and found that no one else bid and I got them for the starting bid of $19.99 which seems pretty good. They are located in the valley which is about a 60 mile drive for me so I believe I can drive there cheaper than the $24.99 shipping cost but we’ll see. As I sat here writing this, a carving board I have been watching was due to end. The seller listed it as a Heavy Tools Drive 160cm Carving snowboard and said it was stiff and fast and a lot of fun. I could see it was a real carving board and maybe a racing board but the starting bid was only $20 and no one was bidding. I went ahead and bid and I got it for $20 + $35 shipping which is reasonable for a board coming from Colorado. The seller was the original owner who bought it as new old stock. As he put it, this is a good cheap way to try out carving. Now comes the hardest part, finding a set of plate bindings. I see that they don’t come up much and then usually get bid out of sight. I wanted to get a board that already had bindings but a good combo just didn’t come up in time. I may still do that if a beater board with good bindings comes along. I will just use the board as an early and late season rock board. Anyway, let me know what you think.

BTW, I managed to find soft boots for both kids. A 32 dual boa for my daughter for $0.99 plus a 138cm Lamar Dante Fire Design board for $19 and Head Jr Boa boots for my son for $19.99 which he already loves (he can put them on himself which is a big deal when you're 6). Of course all were plus shipping but they’re all pretty good deals and the boots were almost new. Sorry about the long post but it was an eventful day.

Post by **eaglefly** » Wednesday 18 November 2009, 20:43

With 1 euro = almost 1.50$ these days, I 'm pretty sure that a bunch of people around here would "kill" for this kind of prices ...

Post by **Transistor Rhythm** » Wednesday 18 November 2009, 20:56

eaglefly wrote:With 1 euro = almost 1.50$ these days, I 'm pretty sure that a bunch of people around here would "kill" for this kind of prices ...

Just too bad the salaries of American people didn't went 1.5 times up as well....only for Goldman Sachs employees

Post by **harald** » Thursday 19 November 2009, 9:59

If you want to do EC you need a lot of flex in the shell and then a top strap is not needed. As you correctly noted, hardboots are softer (more flexible) than skiboots. I do both skiing (most slalom and GS and I used to compete and ski gates previously) and snowboarding (carving). On the skis the movements are shorter and you need a pretty stiff boot both forward and laterally to transmit your leg pressure directly into the skis. In carving (board), except for racing, the movements are longer and you need to be able to bend the knees pretty much. Therefore, the ideal hard boot is pretty stiff sideways and very flexible forwards. Thus an ideal boot is the Northwave Point 900, which are almost impossible to get. After the discussions at this forum I think at the Raichles/Deeluxes, the model next to the top level superstiff racing boots, with spring modifications are very good alternatives to the NW. Also the Heads with modifications seems very appropriate. Unfortunately, I have no experience with these boots.
Good luck in your search.

Post by **goofyfoot53** » Friday 20 November 2009, 3:22

I’ve done pretty well on eBay by just knowing what I’m looking for, deciding what an item is worth to me, and sticking to that max even when a bidding war starts. People sometimes seem to go crazy, bidding an item well above what it is worth which is foolish since there will always be another one. But I’m looking for bargains, so I hold out for those items that, for some reason, aren’t generating bids. Sometimes the ending time is odd, other times the title is missing key search words, as with these boots. However, there are items people ignore for no discernable reason, like my daughter’s boots. It’s a mystery to me but I’ll gladly take it.

Harald
Thanks for the advice on needing a lot of flex to do EC. I didn’t know that but these are the types of things I need to learn. Part of the reason I wanted a top strap would have been to take up the slack/slop around the top of the cuff. I haven’t tried these on yet so maybe that won’t be necessary and if it is, there may be a better way, such as the Eliminator Tongue Pads. The 724 seems to have a sort of half strap like my old Raichle Flexon ski boots. In fact, these look an awful lot like my old Flexons, even down to the grey tongue on dark blue shell. I attached a pic of the boots I bought so you can judge for yourselves. Those old Flexons skied pretty well, with a nice even flex, which started out soft and ramped up evenly. When I flexed very hard though, I did get a bit of instep bite. They did hurt but all my boots hurt. At the time, I didn’t know different tongues were available. Is that also true for the Raichle 724?

BTW, you mentioned spring modifications, which seems to be something everyone does. Will I need to do that to these Raichles or is it not worth it for these inexpensive boots. And am I too inexperienced to even appreciate it. Thanks again for the tips.

Post by **harald** » Friday 20 November 2009, 10:16

Unfortunately, I do not know the 724 very well and it was difficult to see the kind of spring or forward lean mechanism at the back. However, the Bomber BTS is not that expensive and it takes you 30 seconds to replace it. I would recommend that modification.

Post by **pokkis** » Friday 20 November 2009, 11:07

Those boots have that adjustable fix lock with walking position.
But i also supports Haralds proposal for Bomber BTS, and with yellow soft springs. Check first Bomber forum for sale section if there are some there.

Post by **joemzl** » Friday 20 November 2009, 12:41

Maybe we should correct model type now.
There has never been a 724.
It is the 124, the oldest carve boot from Raichle.

Even if you change one time to a newer DeeLuxe, the BTS works on newer boots too of course.

Post by **goofyfoot53** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 19:39

Thanks joemzl,
The seller probably misread the 1 for a 7 if the number is marked on the boot. I haven’t seen them in person but I am picking them up in a few hours. Does the fact that it the oldest carve boot from Raichle mean the boots are not worth the low price I paid?

I know there were some issues with he early Raichles that were improved, such as the buckles. That’s why I inquired whether it was worth investing in the Bomber BTS kit for old boots like these. The kit is currently $99 new on Bomber’s website but maybe I could find a used one if that’s acceptable, or a closeout. Or should I just use these boots the way they are to see if I like carving (how could I not, right). Is the Bomber BTS setup something that you all would deem necessary to have a positive experience out on the slopes and thus, a must have?

Right now, my biggest hurdle seems to be finding good bindings. Most I see online are the Burtons but I have read that they are prone to breakage if you weigh over 160 lbs. due to the extensive use of plastic in the base. Therefore, since I weigh 210 lbs, I have avoided any of them so far.

By the time I see any responses, I will have the boots so I will give you my initial reaction then. Thanks.

Post by **joemzl** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 20:04

Rock solid quality from USA
http://cgi.ebay.com/Bomber-Trenchdigger ... 4a9c586b4e
But poor american eBay.

Nearly no bindings for hardbooters.
Perhaps you should have a look on german eBay.
http://cgi.ebay.de/Snow-Pro-Race-Hardbo ... 25576c9a0a
and
http://cgi.ebay.de/Proflex-Harboot-Plat ... 439b940595
or if you are quick
http://cgi.ebay.de/PHIOKKA-Virus-Snowbo ... 3ca77316ca

Post by **pokkis** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 20:07

Those TD's are TD1's and i would not recemmend those.

Post by **joemzl** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 20:11

Why not? You know I have them too.

Post by **pokkis** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 20:23

They are very durable bindings, i have had few pairs of them myself too, before moving to TD2's

But They have very small foot print and due that they can rip off your inserts, specially if you are bigger or agressive rider.
Plus they are quite stiff so for beginner something more flexy would be better, like rest of your links

Check also Bomber forum for sale section, for other stuff too. Another option is Craigs list.

Post by **Schneewurm** » Sunday 22 November 2009, 20:33

Hi goofyfoot53

As I read Your funny threads, I felt me like back on Disneyland resort near of You!
So welcome to the magic! The magic world of carvers. For to get experience with Your new stuff, You can just go some vew miles next of You to Disneyland for to take a cablecar - an exclusive advantage which only very vew users on this forum have. Unfortunatly I think there is no slope out of snow beside the cablecar.
Can there be find at Fullerton Amtrak railway station some direct access (by Union Pacific railroad or AT & SF railway) up to some nice snow covered mountains of US or Canada?

- - - -

Raichle SB 124 improved! Only SB 125 was comming with 4 buckles. 124 had 3 buckles and 1 strap, but some customers had improved them with an additional 4. buckle.
Please mark, this SB 124 boot was the first boot of all 3 Years of the SB 122 / 123 / 124 / 125 lineup.
Produced on 1994 !
Not Intec-compatible and it's hard now-a-days to get some new gripy heel-rubber-parts for it!
Beside that, liners of first SB's are on poor quality and comfort. They had improved them very much. Go to the SB-325 with red inner colar on liners (SB-325 are better for Your weight). But don't buy worn-out items (loose fabrics).
The light grey tongues of Yours SB-124 are the softer ones, the dark blue tongues have been much stiffer!

Sizing:
MP 27/27.5 solelength = 295 mm
MP 28/28.5 solelength = 303 mm
MP 29/29.5 solelength = 313 mm
(solelength is moldet in on innerleg-side outside of heel)

Bomber BTS are not required for Your first rides. Burton Race Plate or Burton Rental bindings (with special tool-less drive above the board fixing screews) are o.k. Buy two pairs of them, take one piece as a backup up to Your wintersports-resort.
If You can find it in US, also older Bomber bindings, like the Toaster or from the more expensive brand tridentsports the Ratrap Ratrace will be good..

Post by **goofyfoot53** » Monday 23 November 2009, 5:18

I picked up the boots. I can see why the seller thought the were 724. The numbers are sort of abstract so the 1 looks like a 7. They were so dusty that my hands got dirty from touching them. I took them home, pulled the liners and cleaned them up. Although the liners look good from the outside, I think they are shot. The inner surfaces are wrinkled up and there is a sticky substance inside on the instep area and the outer heel that I could not completely remove. The shell looks pretty good but one of the knobs on the adjustable lean was broken off so the left boot can only be set on 2 and 3 (1 is the most lean & 5 is the least). The boot has four buckles. However, none of this may matter because the boot seems too big. I tried it on my right foot and my heel can move up and down, as can my forefoot. My forefoot can also move side to side a little. Oddly, the bale on the instep buckle is so short I can only latch the first tooth and that is very difficult. All the others are midway in the adjustment range. I don’t know if new, longer bales are even available these days. The shell is marked 28-30.5 and it measures exactly 30.5cm from the toe to heel where the binding bales would sit. The liner is marked 29.5, which is odd for a 28 shell. Is this normal or could someone have replaced the liners with ones that are too large? If I can get a board and bindings, I may place a flat, thick insole under the liner and put my superfeet inside so I can at least try them. Then I will know if it is worth investing in new liners for these shells, along with the Bomber BDS kit, as opposed to finding new boots. On the subject of bindings, I looked at the German eBay but I can’t read a word written there.

I may not even have a board. I bought and paid for a board on 11/16, but I haven’t heard a word yet from the seller, despite two requests for an update on the status. It’s possible I may get a knock on the door in a day or two from the UPS guy with board I hand. It has happened before. Here are a few pics of the board. Maybe you guys can tell me if it will work for me. Thanks.