Arm injuries

[NateW]

Yesterday I sprained my thumb during a toeside carve. I didn't think too much about it, just started paying more attention to my hand position... But I just read about Olaf tearing up his shoulder and now I'm thinking maybe arm injuries are a topic worth talking about.

Have you injured your hand or arm? How did it happen?

What do you do to reduce the chance of such injuries?

I was carving my toe edge, with my 'rear' arm touching the snow lightly, palm down, fingers forward, when something happened (not sure what) and my thumb got pulled backward. I'm not exactly sure what caused it, it didn't really interrupt my turn, and the pain didn't set in right away so I didn't think about it much at the time. But over 24 hours later it still hurts to use my thumb.

So, I started making a fist, and keeping the edge of my hand close to the snow, rather than my palm. And trying to NOT touch the snow with my arm - something I've been trying to avoid just for reasons of style (though now it does seem safer as well now). It's difficult to escape that habit!

[nils]

injured left wrist few days ago in a backside (am regular) turn on too soft snow...The board dugged a trench almost 10cm deep and i almost crashed on my hand...Pain appeared the evening and its been three days and its imporving slowly...Avoid carving very low when the snow is very soft !
Nils

[cmachine]

Hi NateW

didn't really interrupt my turn

Yes that's cool. You are a real carver. First finish the current carve at any price and look later for any damage

Have you injured your hand or arm? How did it happen?

Yes, last season I injured my finger because of a little ice cube on the slope. This year I use mittens instead of finger-gloves. Maybe it's better, I don't know.

Regards
Olaf

[Mphdemon]

I think that at least once a season I manage to hurt my arm, I don't sprane it or anything it just get's really sore and really stiff. What always seems to happen to me is that there will be different sufaces on the trail. Like one part will be hard packed and then there will be a sudden patch of soft snow. What happen's to me is that I will make a carve on the hard packed, but my upper body will be over the soft snow, and when I get low enough to touch the snow with my hand then my hand catches on the soft stuff and gets wrenched backwards. Honestly I'm suprised I haven't gotten hurt worse than I have so far. Anyways that's my story, if you guys come up with a solution then let me know.

[skywalker]

a fiew years ago when I was carving for about 2 or 3 years, I injured my thumb, too. First of all I have to say, that I learned to fall on my fists and manage to do so almost every time. The snow was very soft that day and I wanted to impress my friends. So I started carving at very low speed an so nearly fell on a frontside turn. I could get my hand down, but my thumb sticked in the snow and was wrenched backwards badly. Still today I can't bend this finger as much as that one on the other side, but it was my own fault Maybe I've learned rather to fall than making such a stupid mistake.

Now something more serious: I did not get injured when carving deeply, but I think, it was shear luck. My left arm was wrenched backwards for several times. I think, a lot of Fitness-training helped me in these situations. Each time this happened, it was because of little bumps or soft snow, in which my arm sticked more or less. So I think, going really deep is very dangerous if the slope is not groomed perfectly! Maybe also going deep more smoothly (like Patrice ) would help avoiding injuries because you have more time to place your arms and upper body on the slope...

Stay healthy in 2004!!!!

Tom

[rilliet]

Each time this happened, it was because of little bumps or soft snow, in which my arm sticked more or less.

Patrice and I are very careful with soft snow heeps. If they are too high, we stop EC for the day.

This is why the golden rule is to be the first on the slopes in the morning sothat the grooming is in good condition and there is few people.

Jacques

[harald]

A couple of days ago I hurt my left middle finger a little bit and also the right shoulder, but fortunately not serious this time. It happened when I was going at a very moderate speed on a steep, very narrow and icy slope (with only artificial snow) in the wood. My intention was to make a slow heel turn at the very edge of the slope where there still were groomed snow. Instead of turning, the edge catched the snow and I went straight forward and stumbled over big frozen ice lumps at the slope edge and into the wood rolling over my head. Fortunately, I did not hit a tree and only 30 cm from my head it was a big stone. As I wore a helmet and solid wrist protectors nothing serious happened this time but I dare not think what could have been the result without the helmet and wrist protectors.

What do you do to reduce the chance of such injuries?

Since I am not so young anymore (62 years) I need some time to warm up and get used to the snow conditions. So, if possible, I run the first or first two or three runs very calmly, inspecting the snow conditions, testing the grip of the surface, watch out for icy spots, ridges after the pisting machines, holes in the snow, ice lumps or other things that might cause injuries before increasing the pace and going deeper in the turns. And, as I wrote, I wear a ski helmet (started four seasons ago) and wrist protectors outside the gloves (they also are fine for sliding the hands and protecting the gloves as well). In my opinion, injuries can be reduced by warming up before going full speed and taking a rest or cease running when you feel tired.
Luckily, I live only 15 minutes by car from my home to my local ski area, and have a seasonal pass, so it is easy to practice often, relative intense and short sessions before being too tired.

[Sammyboy]

Hi all,
about preventing injuries;

Every day before hitting the slopes I do a 15 minute warmup, with some jumping, running and streching, not only for the legs, but also for my arms.
Everytime I do this, people look at me and my girlfriend like we're crazy! I think most injuries would have been less serious when the muscels are warm and strong.

The legs are fixed to the board, they will 'burn', but you seldom hurt them badly. The upperbody is different. In EC the 'ideal', most smooth position for your arms is one down your body and one above your head. This arm above your head (look at the beautiful style of cmachine for example) is in a 'maximum' position. You can hardly move your arm more up yourself. If there's a snow bump or so and your arm catches snow, the shoulder will dislocate very easely. The recovery is very very hard.

To J&P, how do you guys see the balance between 'purity' and 'smoothness', and the reduction of injury danger, by keeing your arms in front of your body and angled instead of extended?

To avoid inuries, we'll probably and up in a fitness studio after all, training shoulder and upperbody.

cheers,
Sam

[rilliet]

To J&P, how do you guys see the balance between 'purity' and 'smoothness', and the reduction of injury danger, by keeing your arms in front of your body and angled instead of extended?

We both never had serious injury with arms and fingers. Sometimes it happens but without more consequence than pain during a few days. Except once I hurted one of my fingers on ice and I needed the whole summer do have any pain away. But I still could do EC.

As I said in an other thread, be very careful with the soft snow heeps. They are located on hard snow, so you are able to carve very low and they can catch your arms. When they are too high and numerous Patrice and I stop EC and ride normal.
In my opinion, one of the best way to avoid such injury is to be at the opening at the resort. The pistes are perfectly flat and there is very few people, that limits any collision risk.

In your EC riding technique try to put the most force you can on your board edge and not on your arms. Eventually go lower sothat the pressure is distributed from your arm to your body.

As some of you said take the time do warm your body and train yourself to get more muscles on your shoulders. Push-ups are very efficient.

Hope this will help

Jacques

[cmachine]

Since I am not so young anymore (62 years)

I have to take my hat off to you.

62 years young and still carving like in your little Profile-Picture. This gives me hope for my future

Stay Deeeeeeep Harald

Regards
Olaf

[harald]

Many thanks for the compliments. We are a little clique of masters (old guys) and some younger ones here in Oslo, challenging each others in getting deep and we have a lot of fun together.
I am looking forward to meeting you in Zinal for learning and inspiration. Regards,

[rcrobar]

Hi Harald

Since I am not so young anymore (62 years)

I have to agree with Olaf, I too was VERY impressed when I read your post that stated your age! I guess age is a state of mind, seems to me you are 62 going on 25. Perhaps a post or two on what the ‘Masters’ of Oslo eat and drink would help us all.

Luckily, I live only 15 minutes by car from my home to my local ski area, and have a seasonal pass, so it is easy to practice often, relative intense and short sessions before being too tired.

I have many years until I will be able to retire, but after reading your post I am ready to retire today! Sounds like a perfect life to me.

Cheers from Canada
Rob

[harald]

Hi Rob,
Thanks again. I think we will keep our diet as a secret for a while (if it is a secret). However, in this city we are so lucky to have the forests with our local ski slopes just outside our doorsteps. As I said, 15 minutes going from home to standing at the slopes with board or skis on my feet (and about the same time in the summer to sea for windsurfing or other waterspors). The ski area where I usually run is open from 10 am to 10 pm (22:00), so even if I have not retired yet (actually working pretty hards for periods) it is easy to get out in the evenings to have some practice. I think, these great environments helps us staying in shape and compensate for the aging process. And now we have just had 30 cm of nice powder so it is hard to sit in the office watching.
Best regards,

[István]

Hand and finger injuries? On average I have one per a day. I only had one more serious 2 years ago, so my middle finger on my right hand is still a bit more thick than the other one.

Girls love it

What I figured out to avoid such injuries is that when my palm touches the ground I flex my fingers up (concave, not convex) so that its my palm and wrist that touches the ground first. And here comes the wrist protector equiped gloves

I think Jacques is right. EC is for perfectly groomed slopes. When it becomes bumpy or too icy I stop EC. Go to the HÜTTE and have some drinks

Cheers,

István

[mhinkkan]

"Guide to Shoulder Exercises" can be found from http://www.usack.org/shoulder_injury.htm.
The exercises described in the guide are similar to those recommended by my physiotherapist, after dislocating my shoulder during snowboarding.

Regards,
Marko