Beginners carving setup

[starikashka]

Oh my god!!! I do not understand how F2 with such strong marketing motos come to a situation close to bankrupt

Silberpfeil is a good board known as a carving machine. Very popular in Russia. Was my first alpine board. I started learn EC and replace it when start flying over board nose - was too soft . You can try to master EC on Silberpfeil but there are better choices avaliable in market. I know at least 3 boards which are good to learn EC - Swoard, Virus and that which is not good to metion here. I ride all in similar condition

I think if you will buy Silberpfeil you will not loose much money when you understand that you made mistake bying this to learn EC. It is your money, your time - so you decide what to do, but i would not buy any F2 boards to learn extremecarving as this explained on this site if i was you

[Enotain]

Just a humble question...
I already have an F2 Eliminator board, happy riding it with soft setup.

I'd like to try carving in hard boots (not learning EC, just freecarve) but don't want to invest in full hard setup for now.
So the question is - can I use Eliminator with hard boots/bindings?
What the recommended bindings could be?

Thanks in advance,

Eno

[Transistor Rhythm]

All boards have the same hole patterns, so you can put any type of binding on any type of boar (except for Burton). F2 bindings are affordable and good. Again any type of hardboot will fit, but you make the choice between Intec and regular. Intec is easier to get in and out of but sometimes the cable you use to release can fail. Also it seems to be less good for extreme carving, but you need to ask someone that has both tried types of bindings and really can extreme carve, which I'm not

So I would try to find some F2 bindings and buy the best fitting boot you can find (forget about the rest - comfort is everything! You can modify most boots a little more to your taste later on).

If you're an accomplished freestyle boarder/carver you should feel comfortable within a day or two on hardboots and the same board. Actually it's not a bad idea at all to gradually increase your setup instead of jumping into hardbooting AND alpine snowboards AND (extreme) carving within the same week

Getting used to a hardboot/plates setup is the easiest part though, in the past many beginners have gone straight to hardbooting and a beginners alpine deck without having much more problems learning to snowboard, you just have more direct feedback - but those boards don't exist anymore

[hera]

So the Eliminator is not really good setup for hardboots...

I would like to start EC, what do you think about the silberpfeil.
Is that a better choise? Or maybe I just buy a swoard 175M (is it no problem for bigfoots like me?

What's the delivery time for a swoard to Belgium?
The board needs to be here before 28 februari

Silberpfeil could be dangerous with nose digging. You will feel more confortable on F2 RS. Extremly stable and damp. You can find a second-hand board at a very decent price. Try older model than 07/08 or the WC series of 07/08, 08/09 model [but maybe too expensive]. The equipe series of 07/08, 08/09 are softer and nose digging too.
If you want to spend more you should go for Swoard or Virus. Both very good boards... more a matter on taste [and binding angles ].
I suggest to rent first and than buy [F2 and Virus you can find in rental].

And by the way, Eliminator is a great board. The best soft board I ever rided. But I guess that that hardboot isn't a good idea on Eliminator. Probably it's gonna work but definitely gonna work better on a alpine board.

[rowies]

Yep shops provide a lille bit simpler procedure for a bootfitting:-) this was me, preparing my feet to get squezzed into 20 mm smaller thermoflex liner. We do not have enough good bootfitters in Moscow, so we do this by our own. Those shops selling hardboots provide very poor quality of bootfitting - one guy said that he would be happy to cut out his feets after 1 hour riding in the boots which he bought and fit in one of Moscow shops. So, poor we are

Do not ask me why i do need to squeeze my feet it`s not explainable in my english

Hey Starikashka,

I went today to the bootfitter. It was really worth it. They measerd all things on my foot and made also a special orthopedic foot sole" because I have "hollow foot sole" on my right foot. Then we did the thermofiiting. I have very wide foot. If I have still problems they suggest to make the plastic boot more wider, they heat the plastic and put something in to stretch it. But I will try first like this. For people in Belgium, this is the adres: http://www.snow-and-fun.be/

[rowies]

If you see the picture, do you think it is necessary to adjust the mountingplates of the bail clips so the bails are more centered on the plate , now they are really on the end of the plates...

[fivat]

I see that you have some canting in your bindings.

Our recommendation here:

Avoid any canting pad (set your bindings flat on the board), because it harms significantly the correct body movement and edge control.
[...]
The lateral canting pads put the knees together and reduce the backside edge grip under the rear foot (the tail will sideslip) and also reduce the movement ability.
Furthermore, the board bending during the laid turns already induces a canting under both feet.

Here too:

For extremecarving, the Swoard Team recommends to put the bindings flat and to remove any canting or heel pad.

With the search tool, you can find many subjects about the question.

Patrice Fivat

[starikashka]

Hey Starikashka,

I went today to the bootfitter.I have very wide foot. If I have still problems they suggest to make the plastic boot more wider

So, congratulations. You made it right,man
Those guys could put something on the side of your feet and in this case no need to heat plastic shell..Thermoflex liner have miraculous properties - i have 290 mm feet and i put it in 270 MP deeluxe suzuka with thermoflex liner feels very comfortable...but bootfitting itself was a torture for a 30 minutes

Will this plastic heating cost additional money?How much is bootfitting cost you?

P.S.:Listen what Patrice is saying about bindings settings!!Very important!!

[Schneewurm]

There are two positions for fixing the sledge / mountingplates (see picture). Check it, twist the binding head over to be sure nuts are on outer position. But then binding can flex softer then on inner position. (red arrows)

Add some ESD-pad (elastomer damper) to the bindings (see picture). They are comming in red or yellow (fits to wholes = yellow O's on first picture).

Depending on board width, You can remove all the 3°-cantings. For wider boards like e.g. 23-26 cm waist, at about 30-45° rear-foot angle, keep or remove them on front binding, keep it on rear-binding and add (optional!) the two remaining 3°-cantings from the front binding in twisted order as a smooth heel-lift to the heel of the rear foot (needs longer screws).

[rowies]

So, congratulations. You made it right,man

Those guys could put something on the side of your feet

That's wat they did, But he told me to try first and if this is not wide enough they can make the shell wider

Will this plastic heating cost additional money?How much is bootfitting cost you?

The bootfitting costs 10euro and the orthopedic footsole was 60euro
Don't know the price for making the boot wider

P.S.:Listen what Patrice is saying about bindings settings!!Very important!!

On the pictures I see very often that the rear foot is bending to the front, like they would put something under the heel? I think that's wat Schneewurm want's to say... About the ESD pads, I don't have them but check in the shop if they have it. Is it to give more flex on the bindings or is it just to absorb shocks?

Thx all for the information!

[starikashka]

The bootfitting costs 10euro and the orthopedic footsole was 60euro
Don't know the price for making the boot wider

Quite econoimic for a bootfitting.

[Transistor Rhythm]

Well you already paid for the boot ofcourse, this is the kind of extra service that will let you buy your next pair not off the internet but also at the same store

[rowies]

They didn't sell snowboard hardboots, so I had no other option than buy them in another store...
Ive received my board today, I hope they don't ban me from the EC-forum

(its the left one )

[starikashka]

i do not think that you will be banned i do not have a Swoard, just test it once.

[fivat]

Rowies, why would you be banned?
As a snowboarder, I'm glad to see that you go for a wide snowboard and come closer to the essence of snowboarding/surfing, in my humble opinion (it's just my opinion that I give for many years, simply).
As one of the creators of this Web site in 2002 and developer since the nineties with Jacques Rilliet of the real first extremcarving boards, I'm of course a bit sad to see that you have chosen a copy attempt made by opportunists who just try to follow and make money. Note that:
- you get all the technical tips and setup advices here
- we spend time to answer you, kindly and with no interest
- all the extremecarving technique (push-pull, rotation, how to link the laid turns front and back, etc.) has been developed and given here.
The only small gratitude I would hope is that you test the original board one day. Along to various feedbacks, on different snow conditions the differences are very obvious.

Patrice Fivat