DEELUXE + RAB + INTEC test

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Moderators: Arnaud, nils, fivat, rilliet

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cmachine
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Post by cmachine » Monday 23 February 2004, 22:21

On your movie one can see that your solution works much better than the original setup. But the spring can't still be totaly compressed.
Yes, that's correct, but it's the only solution for the poor guys not having a northwave :cry:


The RAB ist designed by Raichle to fit in the same boots that have this 4 or 5 position gliding system and not to obtain a high performance boot.
These boots have been looking more or less the same since the beginning. The RAB is really a pooooor performance of the Raichle engineers :evil: :evil:



Yes but it is not a problem of gliding or lubricant. It's a fundamental mecanical problem.
The first version of the RAB had a smaller hole than the one you can buy now.
The RAB was silver and not black.

Everything was even worse with this silver RAB:
There was almost no clearance between the hole and the brass tube. Using a softer spring, I could move forward a little bit, but I couldn't move back again because it was blocked. Lubricant helped to release the blockig so that I could move back.This is why I recommended (in an other thread) to be sure to get the black RAB.

But you are right Jacques, with the new black RAB the limitations are pure mechanical and lubricant brings nothing. The smaller brass tube I used gives again a little more clearance, but the conceptual limitations remain.

Pokkis: You are right, my movie is made with much more force.

Olaf

david
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Post by david » Tuesday 24 February 2004, 4:43

Hope you guys figure the boot/binding thing out. I first started hardbooting end of last season on a Swoard with TD1 bindings and Raichle AF700 boots.

With this boot /binding setup, I was not able to easily bend my knees, and I used too much effort to get the board to go where I wanted it to go. I got tired very quickly. I started thinking that I may be too old for this sport (I'm 49).8O

I then tried the Raichle Xbone *Carbon* bindings. These are much softer than the TD1, and I noticed a big improvement immediately in my carving progress and style. My arms became much quieter. Even though I think I've read some negative things about these bindings here, they feel really good to me- perhaps because I'm just a beginner!

I then loosened the top two buckles of my boots so that I could bend my knees more. This helped *a lot* to initiate turns, but it is not ideal for stability. So I'm still hoping for a boot solution that will do justice to the Swoard.

Otherwise, thanks to the great instruction and movies on the website, and thanks to the Swoard, I'm carving pretty low for an old guy!

GrimReaper
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rach

Post by GrimReaper » Tuesday 24 February 2004, 13:19

The big problem with the Ralchle/RAB combination is that the angles change a lot.
If you flex the Ralchle boot the angle between the spring and the piece holding it changes. If you want to flex more, the difference is so big it jams.
If you look at the flexing of the Northwave you see that the change in the angles between the plate that holds back the spring and the treaded part is resolved by the palte (By the looks of it it should have a eliptical hole so the tread can move back and forward a bit).

So the solution, as Olaf did, is to reduce the diameter of the brass part sliding throug, or to make the hole in the black part of the RAB bigger. Making the hole bigger whould be my choice. Cause you would still be able to ajust your forward lean, and the boot would keep his leteral stiffnes.


But more interesting would be to see if we can come with a beter design.........

Tom

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dam_s
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Yes ...

Post by dam_s » Tuesday 24 February 2004, 14:30

i'm agree with you GrimReaper i have made the hole in the black part of the RAB bigger because i still can ajust my forward lean and i have put smallest diameter spring
then it work's better
188cm 95kg / Blast 177 coil 166 CAM 162 / la ou il ya de la neige (3 vallées, foret blanche, paradis ski)

jason_watkins
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Post by jason_watkins » Tuesday 24 February 2004, 21:44

I've read a comment by at least one person online that put extra dampening material imbetween the base plate and the toe/heel blocks on TD1's. Perhaps this would be a way to get some flex back with the convenience of INTEC?

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Tim
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My experiences

Post by Tim » Monday 1 March 2004, 23:32

I just came back from my first week of riding step-in TD2's with raichle le Mans boots. I ride the boots in walk mode, because if you lock them they are just way too stif for anything I guess. In walk mode they are quite okay. They could give a bit more resitance in forward flex, a spring mechanism would be nice. A bigger problem is the fact that at a certain point in flexing forward the cuff part of the boot touches the rib on the toe flap and it does not flex further much. (Actually it does flex a bit further, and the toe flap bends in front of the toe buckle and snow gets in the boot>wet feet, really annoying). What I will probably do is cut the cuff of the boot a bit so it can flex further, and make a decent spring mechanism.

I think the Intec system is quite okay, I prefer it over standard bails. My main problem with bails is that from an engineering point of view the design is a piece of #@$%^. It is a shame that snowboard hardboots are still based on the din sole of a ski boot.
But back to the Intec. I agree that it could use a bit more flex (not too much, i like it stiff). I will design and make some new heel pieces for my TD's that allow some lateral flex, should not be much of a problem. I will keep you posted.

Tim

BTW. I built another board which I tested last week. I made it VERY soft longitudinally just to see how that would work out. It turned out to be a bit too soft, but it was amazing how stable the board was compared to other much stiffer boards. Torsional stiffness and a decent flex pattern really does a lot.

Peter
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RAB

Post by Peter » Tuesday 9 March 2004, 9:23

Since i have changed my SB325 to the RAB my carving have improved well. But i have figured out same problem: with silver RAB the spring locks in different positions. Now i have drilled up the hole in the bottom part with 12.5mm. With that change the rab works fine.

BTW: I have changed to springs with a power of ~270N. The original springs were much to stiff, i think this where springs for car bumping. :wink:

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Jakob
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Post by Jakob » Wednesday 17 March 2004, 13:42

Hi everyone!

I just wanted to ask whether you guys make these RAB's alone or you take it from some other boots or you can buy RAB as accessories? :?: I kind of don't want to modify my boots with something that might ruin my boots (clumsy as I am :oops: ), but would sure like get my hands on that system. Unfortunately it's tough to get even hardboots here, not to mention spare parts or accesories. I also couldn't find anything on Dee luxe page (hate it). I have SB423 boots and it seems to me from what I read that RAB can be applied to those boots. :roll:

Any ideas?

Thanx,

Jakob
Element - water.

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nils
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RAB

Post by nils » Wednesday 17 March 2004, 14:19

Yes u can find the RAB in spare parts and put it on your boots as is.It does require some mods to work better thu...

Contact main dealers so they can order the RAB from Deeluxe

Nils

gdboytyler
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Simple RAB modification

Post by gdboytyler » Saturday 20 March 2004, 18:20

I followed the advice from the Forum and installed a RAB on my Raichle 224’s. I got the silver RAB from Bomberonline.com. My set only came with the stiff spring. But I did find a softer spring to use at the maintenance shop at work. Since the spring was in an “assorted springs” drawer, I don’t know the strength of the spring.

Like others that use the RAB, I ran into the lock-up problem and too much forward lean at the minimum position. My solution was to remove the brass tube. This solved the lock-up problem and decreased the forward lean. With the brass tube removed, forward lean is determined by the bottom nut.

It looks like the brass tube is used to prevent the spring from binding against the screw threads. I haven’t noticed any problems caused by the spring rubbing against the threads.

This mod works fine in the living room, but I won’t get a chance to snowboard until next weekend. Has anyone else removed the brass tube? I’d like to know of any possible problems before getting on the snow.

I only removed the brass tube on my front boot. On my rear boot, I do like some forward lean. In my testing, the lockup problem disappears if you have enough forward lean in your setup.

With the soft shell of the 224 boot and the softer spring, I seem to get the same range and ease of motion as the Northwave boots as seen in Rilliet’s movie (right click and save on your hard disk).

I will post a video of the boot mod later this week when I have access to a digital camera.

gdboytyler
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Another mod video

Post by gdboytyler » Thursday 1 April 2004, 8:52

Here's the video of the RAB with the brass tube removed:

Video Clip.

Here's a picture of the brass tube that I removed:

http://members.cox.net/gdboytyler/brass%20tube.jpg

To be on the safe side, I also put cold weather grease on the bolt. I snowboarded with the modified RAB for 3 straight days and did not have any problems. My carving felt smoother with the RAB compared to using the 5-position lean adjuster. Having a spring to adjust the fore-aft flex is a great improvement.

I only removed the brass tube on my front boot. On my back boot, I would like to replace the brass tube with the cylinder nut that is used on the bottom of the spring. This way, I could still adjust forward lean. However, I could not find any cylinder nuts in the local hardware stores. So I left the RAB on my back boot unmodified.

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tommaso2k
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Post by tommaso2k » Thursday 1 April 2004, 11:04

Hi,

i am riding the same Raichle boot and i am interested in changing the 5 forward lean to the RAB as well. I checked on bomberonline but couldn´t find the area where i could only buy the RAB. Could you please help me out here?

Thanks

Tommaso
Brand doesn´t matter, the spirit does!

gdboytyler
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Post by gdboytyler » Thursday 1 April 2004, 19:34

Tommaso,

You're right, the RAB spare part is not shown on Bomberonline's website.

You can email them at "sales@bomberonline.com". Ask to order a Raichle Accelerator Box (RAB) for the Deeluxe Indy.

Bomber had the RAB's in stock when I ordered mine. A set of two cost $39.95 (US).

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Matt
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Post by Matt » Thursday 19 August 2004, 16:21

pete wrote:wow the flex on the northwave is AMAZING!!! And i thought my raichles (223) were soft and flexible... :? :?
Hi

I just saw you have a pair of 223, what is your feeling with thes boots? I have a pair of 121, what are the differences??
M@.
SWOARD 168H / BLAST 162 / Burton Race / SB324

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