One little victory.... Critique needed on backside technique

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vizsyn
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One little victory.... Critique needed on backside technique

Post by vizsyn » Thursday 7 March 2013, 14:53

Hello all!

After countless tumbles, crashes and some very sore gluteus maximus, I have taken a small but important step closer to the ultimate goal!

A lift attendant took an interest in the funny-looking maneuvers I kept trying at the end of each run and took a short video. I've played it repeatedly, analyzing what I am doing. I myself can count a whole bunch of things that I am doing wrong, many things that can be improved.

At the end of this particular turn, I got too excited and sat back up too early, wanting to look back at my track, where I should have just stayed down low. Yes, and I need to place my other arm back along the side instead of waving it wildly in the air for all to see :oops: I also think I am not rotating aggressively enough leading into the turn.

But all in all, this is something to build on... Can't wait for next season already!

Let the critiques begin! I need all the advice and help I can get!

Riding softboots since '96. Saw EXTREME OPUS 4 "LIFTED" in 2010... Back to Square 1

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by yomama » Thursday 7 March 2013, 17:23

I got this advice from my very diplomatic brother that may apply to you "turn your penis in the direction of the turn".... :mrgreen: :tongue: :chinese:

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Weight Distribution of Feet

Post by rcrobar » Thursday 7 March 2013, 18:49

Hi Joe

Man, you are close to having that backside laydown dialed in :bravo:


Short Answer

My gut feeling is that you are putting too much weight on your front foot too early in your carve.

The other details you are already all over! Peter's brothers advice is also excellent :mrgreen:


Long Winded Answer

I am GUESSING (just a guess), that your body is trying to move towards the snow and because you have more weight on your front foot, your board is turning a tighter circle and it won't let your body come to the snow; the board thinks your are trying to stand back up while your body is trying to move towards the snow, the turn radius of your body and the board are working in opposition of each other.

In the video your body is moving downward, after a very smooth edge to edge transition, then it stops moving downward for a moment ... then moves quickly towards the snow at the end of the carve.

The timing of the weight shifting from BACK foot to eventually an even weight distribution on both feet is rushed or maybe your weight is just on your front foot too early period. When you reach for the snow, at the end of the carve, it puts even more pressure on your front foot ... on harder snow the nose of the board will probably break free and chatter out.

Just a guess that I hope might help
Rob

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by keepTheSport » Thursday 7 March 2013, 19:40

Wow..pretty good attempt..won't be long until you nail it :D
Such fun-gr!
One more try-bk!

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by Matti » Thursday 7 March 2013, 20:05

Hei Joe,

Very basic thing - there is no rotation. You should train push&pull inc. BIG rotation. All you need is rotation.
Keep going :bravo: .
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The Transition

Post by rcrobar » Friday 8 March 2013, 0:26

Hi Joe

I agree Matti!

I would add to this to think about your TRANSITION. A lot of things happen really quickly in the transition, the rotation included, and the better it is executed the easier the rest of the lay-down seems to fall into place.

During the transition the following all happen simultaneously: board goes from edge to edge, shoulders rotate from the + to the - or the - to the + position, you down weight/ bend the knees from relatively straight to 90 degrees, you have the majority of your body weight on your back foot while keeping your upper body relative perpendicular to the slope, allow your body to fall deep into the next turn, etc., etc.

Maybe when you think about the transition make it feel like you are almost sitting or squatting on your back boot or the tail of the board. Bend the legs a lot and rotate a lot and have this all completed by the time the board has changed from one edge to the next.

The reason I suggest this is my guess is you are really watching the lay down portion of your video, which is completely understandable. But ... I would suggest that the lay-down is made or blown early in the turn during the transition.

My next guess Joe is that you know all of these details already. The interesting thing is that you probably thought you were already rotating and bending a lot ... then you saw the video that shows otherwise. Most guys can probably say they have had a similar experience, I know I have.

Best of Luck in Your EC pursuits!
Cheers
Rob

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by vizsyn » Friday 8 March 2013, 16:03

THANK YOU to all of you that have weighed in with your analysis, pointers, and especially encouragement! :clap3: :clap3: :clap3:

WEIGHT DISTRIBUTION
@Rob--- Your hunch is 100% correct :pray2: . I do have a VERY strong tendency to be front-foot heavy. What you say makes sense... I am loading the nose pretty hard (and way too early) going into the turn, causing it to hook the board into a very short radius turn, giving me very little chance of laying out.

ROTATION
@Peter and Matti---- You are both correct that I am not aggressive enough with the rotation. I love your brother's advice Peter :chinese: "In order to get LAID in the snow, in pursuit of the perfect BACKSIDE, one must gyrate(ROTATE) hips to aim penis to the goal" :mrgreen: :evil2: :lol2: :clap2:

I should be attacking the backside turn with a strong, committed rotation from -Egyptian to a +Cross, along with a very deep "pull" almost squatting over the board as I prepare to "push" the board once the backside edge engages

TRANSITION
I have guessed that the entire success or failure of a backside EC attempt is predicated on getting everything set-up and timed correctly. Watching my video, and noting your observations, it is now clear that I did this...
-From the frontside, I have the approach ready, BUT...
-Did not squat back far enough over the rear foot(need more aggressive "pull" as I start dialing in the rotation)
-Did not rotate aggressively to set the edge early enough
-Front foot was already too heavy as the turn started
-Only started pushing the board as the turn had already progressed past the halfway point. Too late!
-Only got that "laydown" toward the end of the turn(should have already been laid out much earlier)
-Other arm stuck up in the air like a flag :oops:
-Got too excited, sat back up and looked backwards to admire my track, losing all edge pressure AND counter-rotating out of the turn in the process :wall: :rules:
-need more speed

Much more practice needed. :rules: Many flaws to correct. :oops:

But everyone's advice and words of encouragement has been very motivating, it's good to know that there are people all over the world that I have never met in person that want to see me succeed in this quest. I deeply thank you all for taking an interest in my progress :pray2: :pray2: :pray2:

One day, I shall make you proud! :D
Riding softboots since '96. Saw EXTREME OPUS 4 "LIFTED" in 2010... Back to Square 1

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by corviuscorvax » Monday 11 March 2013, 18:25

vizsyn, I totally didn't realize you are on the east coast. I am in NJ, and head up north when I go riding. I have a friend....both of us are trying to figure out this EC thing. I think I am VERY close (almost to the point where it might be equipment holding me back to some degree), but I have a lot to learn. Anyways, it might be a little late this season to meet up, but next year we should totally ride together!

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by EXtremeBrooklyn » Tuesday 12 March 2013, 14:20

I am based in NYC going this Saturday to elk or hunter or other. Let' s try to get together. I attented this years ECS. Learned a lot about the Push and Pull technique which will help to progress into the extreme carves. Talk soon
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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by EXtremeBrooklyn » Tuesday 12 March 2013, 16:52

Or Windham
SWOARD 175 H, Dual 175, UPZ RC10 orange, Burton 180 Super Model

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by Petr » Tuesday 12 March 2013, 18:21

Hey Joe,

What has already been said is true: you need more rotation (and indeed rotate your hips and this should all happen as early as possible at the initiation of the turn) and more aggresive push. In your video you should be almost fully rotated already at 0:13.

Try to start your backside (already when approaching) with your left hand (because you ride goofy, for regular all is reversed) already put on the inner side of your left thigh (note that the inner side is important!). This helps to "close" your left shoulder and forces you to do the rotation correctly (correct "PLUS" position). Push your left shoulder (I call it the leading shoulder for backside for goofy) to the piste during the turn and try to ride as much as possible on the breast (! yes, breast for the backside). Exaggerate this at the beginning, when you train it and before you get the correct feeling for the degree to which this should be done. Keep the hand on the inner side for all the backside turn. This should give you the correct "PLUS" position (take a look at the banner above "10 YEARS ECS" and analyse the position).

You will get it soon , I am sure. Send us then your video 8)

Cheers,
Petr

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Re: One little victory.... Critique needed on backside techn

Post by vizsyn » Wednesday 20 March 2013, 3:24

Hi Petr! (and everyone else for that matter)

Winter has effectively ended here :( and unless I can squeeze one more day out of a distant resort, it looks like I will have to wait at least another 9 months before I can resume my quest to become a SWOARDER.

How I wish I had the time and the means to attend a Zinal ECS event.... Maybe someday :pray: :pray: :pray:
Riding softboots since '96. Saw EXTREME OPUS 4 "LIFTED" in 2010... Back to Square 1

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